The organizers of a recall of the Paris Town Board say they will challenge the decision of town Clerk Beverly McCumber that the petitions calling for a recall of the Town Board were insufficient.
Said recall leader Joseph Kolnik via a Facebook post:
Elections are the method in which an elector’s voice is heard. This action denies that voice. Why are they refusing to let the people have a voice?”
McCumber found that the number of signatures collected were sufficient, but rejected the petition as insufficient because of statements in the recall petition that she said could have misinformed signers. From the certificate of insufficiency:
The misleading statements that the officeholder did not follow the law in carrying out his official responsibilities in the reasons for recall could have induced a person to sign the petition who would not have otherwise signed the petition. I find that the misleading and untrue statements make the petition insufficient.”
A written sworn complaint about the finding of insufficiency may be made to the Wisconsin Elections Commission within 10 days of the Aug. 5 finding. A spokesman for the recall group said Tuesday that the group does intend to file a complaint.
Petitions asking for a recall were filed by Kolnik, Paul Terry and Robert Fliess on July 6. The incumbents each filed a challenge to the recall on July 15.
The recall organizers were mobilized by the board’s handling and approval of an intergovernmental agreement with Somers, which includes the mass transfer of 2,500 acres from Paris to Somers.
Town officials say the agreement will help the town secure its boarders while sharing in revenue from development along I-94.
Opponents object to what they see as a forced relocation that will diminish the value of their property.
Nope, the main issue is that they are spending half the town’s reserves and didn’t get the approval or consultation of the people. Look how many signatures came from OUTSIDE the zone. In other words: fiscal responsibility, trust and accountability!
Paris Taxes will rise if Paris allocates $10 million to the Village of Somers with no return.
The agreement requires Paris to “give” money to Somers. Here’s the list of allocations Paris makes:
*$3.0 million interest free loan to Somers.
*$1.25 million fee to Somers.
*$0.5 million legal bill for Somers
*$0.2 million legal bill for Paris
The only thing that will earn a return is another $5 million loan to Somers but even that will only earn AAA rates when Somers is BBB+ rated (Somers has the worst municipal rating in all of Kenosha County). Not a smart place to make a loan – if we only need AAA returns, we should only take AAA risk.
The agreement which allocates $10 million from Paris to Somers (1/2 Paris reserves) will result in higher taxes!
Well folks,,,yah just can’t make this stuff up!!! Town Clerk asserts she might have “misinformed signers”. Well, we certainly can’t have THAT now, can we???!! Incredible!
Meanwhile, Somers is STILL having trouble obtaining sewer and water from the city of Kenosha…EAST of the I! Oh that’s right…..we’ll just get it from Racine..not to worry!
You cannot survive for more than:
* 3 minutes without air
* 3 days without water
* 3 weeks without food
What if Paris wells become contaminated? Paris should plan for a backup water supply. An alternative like Lake Michigan would be ideal.
As of June 30, 2016, the Wisconsin DNR:
* issued a “Final Decision” that Somers does NOT have the right to provide water to Paris.
* stated that Somers doesn’t even have the right to bring water to Somers land on the east side of the Interstate.
The City of Kenosha is the only municipality that can provide water to Paris. If we use Somers to block Kenosha, we also block access to an alternative water supply.
Waukesha has had problems with it’s water since 1987 and just now is getting approval to access water from Lake Michigan:
http://www.marketplace.org/2015/02/03/sustainability/water-high-price-cheap/waukesha-spa-town-took-its-water-granted
Think it can’t happen in Paris? Look at these maps of existing contamination in Southeast Wisconsin including northeast Paris township:
http://urbanmilwaukee.com/2014/11/19/hundreds-of-wells-polluted-and-unusable-in-southeast-wisconsin/
Blocking access to water is extremely short sighted.
I plead with the Town Board – please use some common sense.
Town officials say the agreement will help the town secure its boarders.
Would you allocated $10 million to protect the land along I-94?
Town officials are banking on revenue sharing from development along I-94.
Please, who are we fooling?
Look at the Interstate from Hwy 142 to Hwy KR. How much development is there? Land along the Interstate is the most valuable land in all of Somers. If that land could be developed, it would have been.
Who is foolish enough to believe Somers is going to develop land in Paris?
Nearly 300 people signed the recall petition and their reasons were varied.
*Only 75 of those 300 signatures were in the area to be transferred to Somers (see Town Clerk Certificate) so 225 people signed the recall petition for a reason other than diminished value of their land.
The reason that resonated with most people was higher taxes. Are you willing to pay higher real estate taxes to save the land along I-94 from development?
*For instance, when Uline was developed, did anyone ever say “I’d be willing to pay higher taxes to have that land remain farmland”.
The Town Board is allocating $10 million to keep that land from being developed. That $10 million could be invested and earn a return which would subsidize your taxes. Instead, that $10 million is being spent and no return will be earned.
Where are your priorities? If we could get a vote, the Town of Paris could decide. Without a vote, only the Town Board decides.
How would the Town of Paris vote if given a choice on the Intergovernmental Cooperation Agreement?
How would the Town of Paris vote if a Recall Election was scheduled?
If the Town Board gets their way, we’ll never know.
Town Clerk denies petition even though the number of electors that signed was sufficient. Town Clerk determines that the “reason statement” was misleading and therefore denies EVERY signature.
I wasn’t tricked and my signature was thrown out. Were you tricked? Were the people circulating the petition tricked? It’s seems a bit over reaching to throw out EVERY signature.
If you really wanted to know if someone was tricked or not, schedule a vote. With a vote, we’d know how people really feel.
Truthful lips endure forever, but a lying tongue lasts only a moment
http://biblehub.com/parallel/proverbs/12-19.htm
NW Mike was right. Personally, I would have never predicted the need to use technicalities to deny the people a right to vote on such an important issue.
History will decide who was right.
I think it’s time for a criminal investigation. Anyone can go to the DA and request it.
All you legal eagles, please correct me if I get this wrong.
Salem has a rule as a “Town” that to spend certain kinds of monies they have to get the “Electors” to vote their approval. Each year at the annual meeting we authorize the board to spend park fund monies that came from past impact fees collected. I’m not sure exactly why this is but it is done each year. So, that said I can’t see why the “Electors” of Paris can’t vote in a provision to the town by-laws that reads something like this.
“The town board needs elector approval to spend monies exceeding (put in what ever $$$ amount here) on any purchase or payment for any reason.”
With a provision like this the board can still do what they did,( negotiate the IGA) ( which as we all know now they are legally able to do) but they have to come to the electors to fund it! Problem solved. (For the future)
Again, please correct me if I’m wrong.
Salem res.
Oh my!! So much to respond to. Maybe tomorrow. Some short answers.
A loan is not a “give.” The money gets paid back.
You said “misinformed” not me.
Just get it from Racine, sounds like a good idea. Wish I had thought about that.
I already buy my Lake Michigan water for drinking and cooking at Woodman’s. No change for me.
How did the DNR get involved?
Yes I would allocate millions to protect land along I-94.
Higher taxes? You’ll have to explain that one.
The board is up for election in April 2017. A recall election is unnecessary and a waste of money. No vote denied. People can vote then.
I agree with the Town Clerk. The board was doing what they were elected to do.
Nothing criminal. Where do you come up with this stuff?
I don’t care how Salem does things. This is Paris not Salem.
Pay attention. You should care how other towns do things. Check into it, Town electors, I do believe need to approve expenditures over a certain amount in an annual meeting or at a special electors meeting by statute. The example given above was about park lands and properties GIVEN but the tru example that should have been given was the apx 10 million on the new Fire Public Works building that Salem built. If the electros hadnt approved of the 10 mil, that building would not have been there. So, NWM get your statute book out and start reading and then just as a double check pull up all the ordinances at Paris and READ. Also, Electors can call a special electors meeting and that could be done at the same time you get more signatures. You must have an agenda for a special electors meeting but you can do it… Make sure that agenda covers a lot of issues that you have tied into this issue. Don’t just make it a single broad agenda item because you want to set the stage for the electors to win. The town chairman will be the chairman for the special electors meeting so you wont have a say at the meeting. But, you do have a say as to the wording of the agenda. Put that wording on your petition exactly as you want it on the published agenda.
It is pretty clear that NWM doesnt/didnt sign but there are others reading this who might want a special electors meeting to DO something to stop further action until the election in April. By the way, at a special electors meeting you can DIRECT the Board to create an ordinance to : (fill in the blanks) and you can DIRECT the Board to create an ordinance pertaining to Intergovernmental agreements to be put to the electors at the start of any expenditures over (fill in the blank).. etc As with the petiotion before, you must be EXACT.. so very EXACT.
Oh, and when you Direct the board, make sure you put in a completion criteria as in Direct the board to (blah blah blah) at the next Town Board Meeting without a Tabling action. or (blah blah blah) not later than (fill in a date)… Your statement will be the motion and vote action unless an elector at the special electors meeting makes a addendum motion, etc etc so be UP on hyour ROBERTS’ RULES….. Considering that you have a petition to recall the Chairman, Check into your ability as a special elector to Motion and Elect by majority or super majority to have another person Chair the meeting. I dont have the time to check it for you……You will have to check to see who the alternate would be by statute to see if this will offer you a more ‘unbiased’ chairman for the meeting.
Since the city of Kenosha won’t be providing water to this project, the possibility that Racine could fill that gap may be a blessing in disguise. Racine has better water~!
A “win win” for everyone!
Unfortunately, Racine is not an option. Racine can not bring water across the subcontinental divide.
At the time of the Great Lakes Compact, Kenosha was already bringing water across the subcontinental divide but neither Racine nor Somers were. Therefore, Kenosha is grandfathered while Racine and Somers are prohibited.
Why was Kenosha doing something Racine wasn’t? The subcontinental divide is very close to Hwy 31 in the southern part of Kenosha County (by Hwy 50). In Somers the subcontinental divide is much further west (just over 1 mile east of I-94) and in Racine County, the subcontinental divide is along I-94.
How can you verify I’m telling you the truth?
Do an open records request via e-mail to the Wisconsin DNR Records Response group (very easy to do and they’ll respond quickly). Here is the e-mail address:
DNRRecordsResponse@wisconsin.gov
Request June 30, 2016 letter from the WI DNR to William Morris, Administrator of The Village and Town of Somers regarding the “Revocation of Diversion Approval”. Request they include “Map 1” “Greater Kenosha Area Planned Sewer and Water Supply Service Area” which shows the subcontinental divide.
*Or if you like reading, request all communications in 2016 between the WI DNR and the Village of Somers.
The Town of Paris.
Why? To fight the Wisconsin DNR and the Great Lakes Compact – that shouldn’t be too expensive.
Did anyone tell you they were fighting another lawsuit?
Here is a link to the lawsuit. https://wcca.wicourts.gov/caseDetails.do;jsessionid=68465806F2FF67329C1DF203677FD4B7.render6?caseNo=2016CV000908&countyNo=30&cacheId=4F84126E2CD624456368B6B2582E029E&recordCount=5&offset=0
Guess who’s paying the attorney for the Village of Somers?
WHAT? Northwestern Mike has bottled lake water from the supermarket? Hey farmers you’re fine you just irrigate with that! No worries guys, I’m sure you can afford to drink bottled water! Fantastic! Go back to sleep everyone. Nothing to see here – even if you want to take a look…
Why is there such a fear for the recall?? I can’t see the big deal in it. Let it happen. See where the dice land.
Anyone to think they can get water from Racine has to be out of it. No matter where you get water from, someone has to pay for the infrastructure to either city’s system. On top of piping it to the interstate area.
Why didn’t the Town try and make an agreement with Bristol?? They are a village to. What would be the difference? How much money could the town have saved?
And Mike since your so gun ho about this we are already giving up 2500 acres of land, why don’t we just throw your 60 acres in with it. What’s 60 acres when you are talking 2500??
If you decide that you do not want to go the route of a SPECIAL ELECTORS meeting, you can always achieve your goal doing the same at the Electors Annual Meeting. At which there is NO need (by statute) to have an aforementioned agenda. You can Have an agenda but you dont NEED an agenda as the meeting is elector driven. Any issue that ANY elector wishes to motion, second and get a majority regarding the directives to the Board regarding this is fair game. I would strongly suggest that a motion be made that no motion to adjourn will be accepted unless and until the Chair has asked – and allowed reasonable time to respond – if there is any more business. You do not want someone to make a motion, second and have unversed electors VOTE yes to a premature adjournment before all of your questions are handled. You can also make a motion to TIMEOUT or REST (no leaving of the room during this) to consult with the group as to any more actions to be taken. The Annual Meeting is the meeting controlled by the electors. Always best to take advantage of something that occurs once a year. Also, the chair for this is a monitor and the only job is to administer the meeting. No control of the business, advisory included. And all the board members during this, should take their places in the audience as regular ol’ electors – not in their board seats. They have no more standing than any other individual in the audience. Appearances are very suggestive you know! At the annual meeting, Directives you give to the board regarding ordinances pertaining to intergovernmental agreements, voting in BINDING elections – not advisory – and Dollar amounts to be spent on other than operations INSIDE the TOWN and not external and not intergovernmental allneed an effective date or accomplishment date to be effective. You must phrase your motions as DIRECTIVES to the BOARD else it will be seen as advisory by the town attorney. We, the electors of the Town of Paris, direct the Town Board to: blah blah blah but blah blah blah date. Annual meeting minutes must be available inside 7 days of the meeting. The meeting also can be continued to another day if it goes too long tho I would not ever do this…. work into th enight if necessary but get the job done. Minutes willnot be approved until the next annual meeting or special electors meeting should there be one inside the period between the annual meetng and the next. If there needs to be a change to anything arrived at via the annual meeting, it can be modified at the next annual meeting or at a special electors meeting. Special electors meetings can be called (30 day notice) by the town board but if an elector wishes to call it, there are special signator requirements and time involved in this effort. A good, fair, open Chairman however would call a special electors meeting whenever there is such a overwhelming concern expressed by the citizens – as we can see is evident here. If the goal of the town is a good goal, then calling such a meeting will be met with good results and there would be no harm to the goal. The cost? 30 days notice and an evening of openly speaking with the electors and accepting direction from them.
1. Waukesha just received permission to get Great Lakes water because their wells have Radium in them. But it was a fight to get it. Google it and read up on it.
2. The person writing about the Electors meetings is very well informed and should be taken very seriously. Anybody in Paris who wants to regain control of the process of approving money for special projects should follow the guide written about here! It is a process allowed by law and can be done.
Like anything else in life when you are on the winning side you are very careful not to tell the other side how to beat you. But that may be what’s happening here where the three board members while justifiably are following the law, could do more ‘if’ they wanted to revisit the issue.
Then again there’s always next year. April 2017 if you want to wait.
60.12 Special town meetings.
(1) WHO MAY CONVENE. A special town meeting may be convened if:
(a) Called by a town meeting.
(b) A written request, signed by a number of electors equal to not less than 10 percent of the votes cast in the town for governor at the last general election, is filed with the town clerk.
(c) Called by the town board.
(2) TIME, DATE AND PURPOSE TO BE STATED. If a special town meeting is requested or called under sub. (1), the time, date and purpose of the meeting shall be stated in the request or as part of the call.
(3) NOTICE. The town clerk shall, not more than 20 nor less than 15 days before the date of a special town meeting, publish a class 2 notice of the meeting under ch. 985. The notice shall state the purpose, date, time and location of the meeting. If notice is posted, the same time and content requirements apply.
(4) LOCATION.
(a) A special town meeting may be held in the town or in any other town, village, or city in the same county or in an adjoining county.
(b) A special town meeting shall be held where the preceding annual town meeting was held, unless the location is changed by the town board.
(5) ADJOURNMENT. A special town meeting may be recessed to a time and date certain if the resumed meeting is held within 30 days after the date of the originally scheduled meeting.
(6) JURISDICTION. Any business which may be transacted at an annual town meeting may be transacted at a special town meeting.
Paragraph (6) is the important one.
“Any business which may be transacted at an annual town meeting may be transacted at a special town meeting.”
The business at a special meeting is limited just like at an Annual Meeting.
What can be done?
60.10 Powers of town meeting.
(1) DIRECT POWERS. The town meeting may:
(a) Raise money. Raise money, including levying taxes, to pay for expenses of the town, unless the authority has been delegated to the town board under sub. (2) (a).
(b) Town offices and officers.
1. Fix the compensation of elective town offices under s. 60.32, unless the authority has been delegated to the town board under sub. (2) (k).
2. Combine the offices of town clerk and town treasurer under s. 60.305 (1).
2m. In a town with a population of 2,500 or more, provide for the appointment by the town board of the town clerk, town treasurer, or both, or of the combined office of town clerk and town treasurer under s. 60.305 (1), at a level of compensation to be set by the board that may not be reduced during the term to which the person is appointed.
3. Combine the offices of town assessor and town clerk under s. 60.305 (2).
4. Establish or abolish the office of town constable and establish the number of constables. Abolition of the office is effective at the end of the term of the person serving in the office.
5. Designate the office of town clerk, town treasurer or the combined office of clerk and treasurer as part-time under s. 60.305 (1) (b).
6. Designate town board supervisors as full-time officers.
(c) Election of town officers.
1. Adopt a plan under s. 5.60 (6) to elect town board supervisors to numbered seats.
2. Provide under s. 8.05 (3) (a) for the nomination of candidates for elective town offices at a nonpartisan primary election.
(e) Cemeteries. Authorize the acquisition and conveyance of cemeteries under s. 157.50 (1) and (3).
(f) Administrator agreements. Approve agreements to employ an administrator for more than 3 years under s. 60.37 (3) (d).
(g) Hourly wage of certain employees. Establish the hourly wage to be paid under s. 60.37 (4) to a town employee who is also an elected town officer, unless the authority has been delegated to the town board under sub. (2) (L).
(2) DIRECTIVES OR GRANTS OF AUTHORITY TO TOWN BOARD. Except as provided under par. (c), directives or grants of authority to the town board under this subsection may be general and continuing or may be limited as to purpose, effect or duration. A resolution adopted under this subsection shall specify whether the directive or grant is general and continuing or whether it is limited as to purpose, effect or duration. A resolution that is continuing remains in effect until rescinded at a subsequent town meeting by a number of electors equal to or greater than the number of electors who voted for the original resolution. This subsection does not limit any authority otherwise conferred on the town board by law. By resolution, the town meeting may:
(a) Raise money. Authorize the town board to raise money, including levying taxes, to pay for expenses of the town.
(b) Membership of town board in populous towns. In a town with a population of 2,500 or more, direct the town board to increase the membership of the board under s. 60.21 (2).
(c) Exercise of village powers. Authorize the town board to exercise powers of a village board under s. 60.22 (3). A resolution adopted under this paragraph is general and continuing.
(d) General obligation bonds. Authorize the town board to issue general obligation bonds in the manner and for the purposes provided by law.
(e) Purchase of land. Authorize the town board to purchase any land within the town for present or anticipated town purposes.
(f) Town buildings. Authorize the town board to purchase, lease or construct buildings for the use of the town, to combine for this purpose the town’s funds with those of a society or corporation doing business or located in the town and to accept contributions of money, labor or space for this purpose.
(g) Disposal of property. Authorize the town board to dispose of town real property, other than property donated to and required to be held by the town for a special purpose.
(h) Exercise of certain zoning authority. In a town located in a county which has enacted a zoning ordinance under s. 59.69, authorize, under s. 60.62 (2), the town board to enact town zoning ordinances under s. 61.35.
(i) Watershed protection and soil and water conservation. Authorize the town board to engage in watershed protection, soil conservation or water conservation activities beneficial to the town.
(j) Appointed assessors. Authorize the town board to select assessors by appointment under s. 60.307 (2).
(k) Compensation of elective town offices. Authorize the town board to fix the compensation of elective town offices under s. 60.32 (1) (b).
(L) Hourly wage of certain employees. Authorize the town board to establish the hourly wage to be paid under s. 60.37 (4) to a town employee who is also an elected town officer, other than a town board supervisor.
(m) Membership of town sanitary district commission. If the town board does not constitute itself as the town sanitary district commission, direct the town board to increase the membership of the town sanitary district commission under subch. IX from 3 members to 5 members, or direct the town board to decrease the membership of the town sanitary district commission from 5 members to 3 members, except that the town meeting may not act under this paragraph more frequently than every 2 years. If a town meeting directs the town board to decrease the membership of the town sanitary district commission, the reduction in members first applies upon the expiration of the terms of the first 2 commissioners whose terms expire at the same time after the town meeting directs the town board to reduce the number of commissioners.
(3) AUTHORIZATION TO TOWN BOARD TO APPROPRIATE MONEY. The town meeting may authorize the town board to appropriate money in the next annual budget for:
(a) Conservation of natural resources. The conservation of natural resources by the town or by a bona fide nonprofit organization under s. 60.23 (6).
(b) Civic functions. Civic and other functions under s. 60.23 (3).
(c) Insects, weeds and animal diseases. The control of insect pests, weeds or plant or animal diseases within the town.
(d) Rural numbering systems. Posting signs and otherwise cooperating with the county in the establishment of a rural numbering system under s. 59.54 (4) and (4m).
(e) Cemetery improvements. The improvement of the town cemetery under s. 157.50 (5).
There is nothing in “Powers of the Town Meeting” that allows this:
“Town electors, I do believe need to approve expenditures over a certain amount in an annual meeting or at a special electors meeting by statute.”
Or this
“By the way, at a special electors meeting you can DIRECT the Board to create an ordinance to : (fill in the blanks) and you can DIRECT the Board to create an ordinance pertaining to Intergovernmental agreements to be put to the electors at the start of any expenditures over (fill in the blank).. etc”
Just some thoughts
There is no fear of a recall. The recall must be done for a valid reason. We gave the Town Board the authority to make decisions on our behalf by electing them. They exercised the authority that was given to them and now you want to recall them. NO. Their term is up April 2017. It can wait.
I was told by someone on the planning commission that the properties in the I-94 Development Zone were determined by the planners and the planning commission. My land was not included.
The Bear and the Maiden Fair
The crops on my land are irrigated by Mother Nature. The crops received 1.8” of rain last night.
So only the city of Kenosha is allowed by the DNR to bring water to I-94. I don’t think so.
Don’t forget about the law that was just passed in the last budget. What trumps the DNR or state law?
By the way, what are the qualifications of those that want to replace this town board?
I haven’t seen anything.
Disgruntled resident does not qualify you to run.
You can run but not many would be foolish enough to vote for you.
INTERESTS ALIGNED
“The Town Board is allocating $10 million to keep that land from being developed. That $10 million could be invested and earn a return which would subsidize your taxes. Instead, that $10 million is being spent and no return will be earned.”
The future shared revenue of any developed land is the ROI of the money that is invested in the IGA.
I buy a stock and I wait for the ROI of stock price increase and any potential dividends. Same for the IGA.
Don’t be so blind.
Joe Kolnik,
“Elections are the method in which an elector’s voice is heard. This action denies that voice. Why are they refusing to let the people have a voice?”
You are a correct elections are the method in which an elector’s voice is heard. The next election is in April 2017, a little over eight months away. No one is denying your say. You just have to wait.
I don’t agree with what Obama is doing so I have to wait for the election in November. I don’t like to wait either.
What are your qualification to run as a Town Supervisor?
Two Thoughts
“2. The person writing about the Electors meetings is very well informed and should be taken very seriously. Anybody in Paris who wants to regain control of the process of approving money for special projects should follow the guide written about here! It is a process allowed by law and can be done.”
NOT BY MY READING OF THE LAW POSTED ABOVE.
.
“(2) DIRECTIVES OR GRANTS OF AUTHORITY TO TOWN BOARD. Except as provided under par. (c), directives or grants of authority to the town board under this subsection may be general and continuing or may be limited as to purpose, effect or duration. A resolution adopted under this subsection shall specify whether the directive or grant is general and continuing or whether it is limited as to purpose, effect or duration. A resolution that is continuing remains in effect until rescinded at a subsequent town meeting by a number of electors equal to or greater than the number of electors who voted for the original resolution. This subsection does not limit any authority otherwise conferred on the town board by law. By resolution, the town meeting may:”
That is the paragraph where the electors have power to create rules the board has to follow.
This is the sentence.
“directives or grants of authority to the town board under this subsection may be general and continuing or may be limited as to purpose, effect or duration.”
It doesn’t give you things to pick and choose from or limit you to. You use this section to write your own ordinances and fill in your own blanks.
NW mike
How did the plan commission know about this IGA if it supposedly happened in closed session town board meetings???? And obviously they didn’t do what EVERYONE elected them to do. If they were honest with the WHOLE town you wouldn’t have over 300 people petitioning for a recall would you? Quote all the laws and statues you want. It means zero when it comes to honesty you should have shown to your neighbors and friends. They are just loop holes the board is going to use to try and keep their power and this IGA.
Now you have 2 people that want to annex to the city. You want to deny them their rights now too? This is a joke, a big scam. They are hiding something that no one knows about. Not one of the current board members have knocked on my door or made sensible comments in the media as to why they are doing what they are doing.
And Mike you can’t keep asking what qualifications the guys have that are going to run against the current board. Do know how ridiculous that is. I mean if we go with that theory WHO ever had political experience before they took office?? No one.
And seriously why didn’t we make an IGA with Bristol???
Just a couple of thoughts….
I was at the annual meeting this year where a significant number of the affected residents showed up and anything directed was only held to advisory for the board. There were directions not to spend money on defending the IGA – but they were only held to advisory for the board after the lawyer input. So a special meeting or waiting for the annual meeting will be unsuccessful.
We need the recall election ASAP to stop the spending of money on lawyers by Paris and the residents of Paris.
Can we recall the town clerk? She seems biased towards the board. And rolls her eyes at the affected residents at the monthly meetings. Not a very professional attitude.
I’m very thankful for Joe Kolnik. He has led the movement against the IGA very well. He has my vote. After watching the current board over and over ignore me and not act in my best interest, I will vote for anyone else that wants to listen and come up with a fair deal for everyone. Screwing the affected residents for their own good is not a fair deal.
Fact is you can’t throw out a petition because you disagree with the reason for it. The WI Supreme Court have already ruled on that so the Clerk is out of order.
Disposal of property…
DIRECTIVES OR GRANTS OF AUTHORITY TO TOWN BOARD..
.and these above are not exercised correctly….. then at the special electors meeting, do not approve of the bottom line on the budget. Reduce the value expressed and force them to change the balance of the operating budget. You cannot make a directive on the specific budget line item but you can limit the money that they spend in total.
Regarding closed sessions. The meeting is closed but after the meeting there is nothing at all that limits what is said and to whom. Flappy lips is a sign of a ill elected or appointed person. Think twice about reelecting or reappointing.
What exactly does the Paris and Somers Comprehensive 2035 plan say for these areas? How is that because Jim Kreuser is involved that the Comp Plan can be trashed? What bout the notice to property owners that there is something happening inside 300 some feet of a property?
Re the Compact. It is not a compact with just other communities in Wisconsin, but with the USA and with Canada. Look at the maps for this and see which communities have access to this water. Hwy 45 is a good line to use. Thank Bob Wirch for leaving half of Kenosha County dry, but allows Pleasant Prairie and Kenosha to allow bottling plants to suck the water from Michigan and sell it but people inside the watershed are not allowed access.
There are other muni attorneys. Pay the hourly rate and get the motion/s of interest to that special electors meeting …
And, rather than contaminate your address consider selling and moving to an area where you will be represented well by the elected officials and who will not dispose of you .
Dear ‘Right here Mike’
Let me paraphrase for you. Directives or grants of authority to town board related to the following areas “a thru m.” ONLY in these areas can you direct the board.
You CANNOT write your own ordinances. You had better reread it.
“This subsection does not limit any authority otherwise conferred on the town board by law.”
Dear ‘Right here Mike’
(2) … This subsection does not limit any authority otherwise conferred on the town board by law. By resolution, the town meeting may:
(a) thru (m)
Nice try.
Dear ‘just some thoughts’
Talk to people on the planning commission. The town planner and the commission were involved.
I talked to several residents at the primary last week and they supported the IGA. 300 is not a majority of the residents.
I don’t know what rock you have been hiding under but from the time I ran for the school board I have talked to the town supervisors and I have heard them say they were working on a boundary agreement with the city of Kenosha with no luck. To me I took it as common knowledge.
It has been no secret that the town board efforts have been spurned by the city of Kenosha.
Ron Kammerzelt is quoted as willing to debate the IGA. Give him you name and debate him.
Asking for qualifications is not ridiculous. Denying the need for them is. Managing a business or having an MBA or a management degree would be useful.
Bristol IGA who knows.
Dear ‘affected resident’
Poor baby
Dear “NW Mike and”
“Regarding closed sessions. The meeting is closed but after the meeting there is nothing at all that limits what is said and to whom. Flappy lips is a sign of a ill elected or appointed person. Think twice about reelecting or reappointing.”
Elector votes at Annual Meeting are only advisory. The Spring Election is where the electors have the real power.
The agenda limits what the topic is that is talked about. Comments in an Open Session only happen at the discretion of the board.
Dear ‘The Bear and the Maiden Fair’
The Wisconsin Elections Commission will decide.
See everyone: the 3 board members and the likes of Northwestern Mike ignore any points about the WI Supreme Court ruling that you cannot throw out a petiton for the reason it was held. They will hide from the people having their say as they know they are in the minority. Otherwise they would have said: ok let’s have a referendum on the issue. Tick tock tick tock…
Lawyers write the laws so that it takes a lawyer to interpret them. Then even worse, you can get them to fight against each other on whose version of interpretation in correct. So why not just call the guys and gals in Madison who wrote the statue to get the correct meaning instead of fighting here.
It’s also cheaper.
Dear The Bear and the Maiden Fair,
MATTER OF RECALL OF DELAFIELD CITY OFFICIAL: MUELLER,Appellant, v. JENSEN, City Clerk, and another, Respondents.
No. 403.
Supreme Court of Wisconsin.
Argued April 1, 1974.
Decided May 7, 1974.
Generally, statutory provisions relating to recall are liberally interpreted in favor of the electorate.[3] The power granted to an electorate to remove certain elected officials through recall procedure is political in nature and it is for the people and not the courts to decide the merits of the reasons stated in the petition.
We believe the legislature, in the enactment of the recall procedures for municipal officials, has established safeguards so that such officials will not be vexed with recall petitions. The requirement that at least 25 percent of the electors of the vote cast for the office of governor at the last election in the district insures the official that he will not have to defend his policies against frivolous attacks launched by a small percentage of disenchanted electors. The fact that the recall petition must state reasons directly related to his official duties with sufficient specificity so that the official can response, to them to the electors also creates a responsive relationship between the official and electors. Also, sec. 9.10 (6), Stats., provides that after one recall petition and election, no further recall petition shall be filed against the same official during the term for which he was elected.
A certificate should have been issued in this case directing the holding of a special election.
From Kenosha News “Paris recall petitions deemed insufficient”
Published August 5, 2016 By JILL TATGE-ROZELL
(David Kreuger, who helped circulate the recall petitions, said there is legal precedent that prevents the reasons behind the petition from being used as a reason to deny it.
Kreuger points to a Wisconsin Supreme Court case regarding the recall of City of Delafield officials in which the judge stated: “The power granted to an electorate to remove certain elected officials through recall procedures is political in nature and it is for the people and not the courts to decide the merits of the reasons stated in the petition.”)
I am very curious who this David Kreuger works for that he knows about a Supreme Court of Wisconsin decision from 1974.
Are there unknown hands playing puppet master with this recall?
“A certificate should have been issued in this case directing the holding of a special election”, but let Wisconsin Elections Commission decide.
NW mike
Michael, I am sure you did not talk to more than 300 people at the primary election last week so how can you say 300 signatures is not the majority? Makes zero sense. Maybe out of the handful of people you talked to you heard what you wanted to but come on.
I do not hide under a rock. I also know that the Town has not been able to make a deal with Kenosha yet. So I guess it just makes sense go to Somers make a deal and kick out neighbors that have been living in Paris and have been proud to be Paris residents for generations. I mean sacrifice a few for others who have only lived in the town maybe 20-25 years.
What is there to debate with Ron? He thinks he is doing the right thing. Again how long as he lived in the Town? How many millions did his family make when his land got developed by Menards? I think that property may just be a bit inside city limits huh??
Asking for qualifications from the 3 that are planning on running in the recall is ridiculous because the 3 that are currently in office had no prior experience in running a Town either. I mean if you think that managing a business qualifies you then the 3 gentleman that are running more than qualify. I know 2 out of the 3 are in the grain farming industry and 1 use to be a farmer as well. And from what I know the agriculture industry is one of the top industries in the USA.
I don’t think you really need a management degree to make this IGA. All you have to do is keep paying a boat load of money to attorneys. I mean I’m only in my 20’s and own a business. In the actual business world this IGA is what you call a loss. You give 1.25 million away. Then loan 3 million at 0% interest. So you have 4.25 million gone from the Town’s accounts. 1.25 is completely lost. The 3 million we are loosing interest money on that the Town is currently receiving. Oh wait, almost forgot we give away 2500 acres as well. Good business management skills there to one smart supervisor.
Michael, you seem kind of worried that if this recall goes forward the current board members will loose there spot. The Bear and the Maiden Fair is right yourself and the current board are in the minority on this subject. Instead of having a recall this late in the game there should have been a referendum on how this was handled.
Who is this David Krueger pushing this recall effort?
http://media1.commercialsearch.com/proppdfs/773/900773_02.pdf
Kenosha Industrial Land
13300 38th St., Paris, WI
Property Specifications
Location: 13300 38th Street, Paris, WI
(Kenosha County at NE corner of Hwy N and Hwy UE)
The land is located in close proximity to I‐94 with two full interchanges at Hwy 142 and Hwy 158 located within a 2 mile radius and in close proximity to the Kenosha Airport which is within a mile and a half of the subject.
The 73 acre parcel adjoins land being annexed into Kenosha.
The parcel contains two homes and a barn which can be seen in the aerials. Electrical wires running north/south divide the land roughly in half.
The land may be subdivided.
Lot Size: 73+/‐ acres, sub dividable
Zoning: Current Land Use: Agricultural
Future Land Use: Industrial
Price: $9,572,963 ($2.99 per square foot)
Utilities: Electrical and telephone
Contact Information
David Krueger, CCIM
Nickpoint Realty, LLC
Who is this David Krueger pushing this recall effort?
He is a real estate agent trying to sell Joe Kolnik’s land at 13300 38th St Paris Wisconsin.
Just so you know who is pulling the strings, someone who will make lots of money on a Recall.
Lawyers, lawyers, lawyers,
Less entertaining
Calling Madison really worked good for Salem. Pat Casey called Madison and got a verbal OK on the nine member library board and then Paddock Lake called and got a written rejection on the same question. Same people in Madison, a verbal OK and written denial. Go figure.
Dear ‘just some thoughts’,
I have not talked to one person in Paris other than Joe Kolnik that supports the Recall. 300 residents is about of quarter of registered voters in Paris.
Yes it does make sense to make a deal with Somers when the beginning price for a boundary agreement with the City of Kenosha was $10 million and NO revenue sharing. Just look at how much revenue Paris gets from the Uline deal.
Whether your people have been here for generations or you are new to Paris makes no difference; one vote per elector. Being here for generations does not grant you with special gifts or insights.
Again it is irrelevant how long someone including Ron has lived in Paris. It is also irrelevant how he makes his money. I sense a little envy there.
Qualifications indeed matter. Experience running a town is not needed, good sense does. If these guys are so experienced let THEM share it, not you.
In the actual business world the IGA is called an investment with a future ROI. The future is not now. Mature a little more and you will learn that.
Whatever your name is, I am not worried. I may be in the minority, but we will never know until an election occurs.
The town board can enter into a boundary agreement without holding a town referendum on the subject. Whether they should have is a different question.